In search of 2417 or 2518

[Abacus]

We are looking to buy a 2417 or a 2518 due to the tongue weight of our SUV. We might consider a 2619 but would have to see how it tows due to being heavier. We are also looking used due to not having available funds for new, we have around $8k. We are in Arizona but I am willing to travel 500-750 miles to find one. I looked but did not find any smaller ones out there in that price range. The $9k one I was conversing about in California just sold (don’t get me started on that mess) so I am back to looking around. We have some time but I would rather get it sooner than later due to the wife being on board for now.

 

[Bill]

Abacus -

You can reduce tongue weight a bit by using a weight distributing hitch, assuming your tow vehicle will accept one. Many smaller vehicles, especially uni-body ones, will not. You would need to check the detailed specs for your specific model/year/equipment package/factory-installed options. Don't rely on generic advertising numbers for tow rating. Instead, go to the mfr web site and look for a multi-page document called something like "Towing Guide". Or take the same info, plus your VIN, to your SUV's dealer if you trust him.

Would you care to share your vehicle's year/make/model info here? Some of our members may be able to help.

A WDH is not cheap, which might be limiting factor.

Bill

 

[Dan3023]

A weight distribution hitch does not reduce tongue weight.

 

[Shane826]

How does it not? It redistributes the tongue weight to the front and rear axles on the tow vehicle and to the trailer axle(s). If the tow vehicle is carrying less trailer weight wouldn’t that be a reduced tongue weight?

 

[Dan3023]

I looked into this a while back.

 

[Abacus]

Thanks Bill. Sure, the vehicle is a 2020 Kia Sorento with 4WD and the V6 engine. It has a unibody construction so not suitable for a WDH. The manufacturers speciations are the 5,000 towing and 350 hitch weight, which has been discussed here previously. I did a search while doing my “homework” and found the threads.

We really don’t want to get another vehicle just for towing as our cars are paid off and new ones are so expensive, and my wife just retired (I’m still slaving away). It’s one of the reasons I’m looking at TrailManors over other types of lightweight trailers.

 

[Shane826]

I guess I’m confused as to what tongue weight is. I always thought it was the portion of the total trailer weight that is carried by the tow vehicle instead of the trailer’s axles.

 

[Kidkraz]

If you're trying to stick with your current tow vehicle, a popup might be a better fit for you til you can get a better tow vehicle.

 

[Abacus]

If you're trying to stick with your current tow vehicle, a popup might be a better fit for you til you can get a better tow vehicle.

From what I’ve investigated, a pop up is about the same weight as the ones I’m looking for.

 

[Dan3023]

You can use airbags to lift the rear up if needed. It will probably be needed. Uhaul or Firestone probably can set you up with that.

 

[Shane826]

Air bags don’t fix the problems of too much tongue weight, they just mask them.

 

[Kidkraz]

Most car manufacturers won't cover damage if a vehicle limits are exceeded.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/broken-ram-3500-dually-shows-a-camper-can-still-overload-a-big-truck

 

[Dan3023]

The airbags will lift the rear of the vehicle so it isn't squatting. You still have to stay within the vehicles weight limits. There really is nothing you can do to increase that limit other than getting a different tow vehicle. My truck 1/2 ton truck squats a little so I use airbags. The TrailManor is well below my capacity too.

 

[Shane826]

But airbags don’t put weight back on the front wheels for steering and braking traction.

 

[Abacus]

Most car manufacturers won't cover damage if a vehicle limits are exceeded.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/broken-ram-3500-dually-shows-a-camper-can-still-overload-a-big-truck

Who is talking about exceeding the tow vehicles’ weight limit? The 2417 and 2518 are well within towing specifications.Even the 2619 is within, albeit on the limit which is why I’m leaning lighter.

 

[Dan3023]

But airbags don’t put weight back on the front wheels for steering and braking traction.

But some vehicles can't use a weight distribution hitch to do that. The air bags are better than having a squatting tow vehicle that will drag at every incline. If the tongue weight is within the limits, the front end will be just fine. The manufacturer of the vehicle knows how much weight is safe. Plus, ther is no danger of folding up the frame of the trailer with air bags.

 

[Bill]

Dan, I've got to jump in with Shane. Air bags do only one thing - they raise the rear end of the tow vehicle to alleviate squat. But squat is only a symptom of a problem, and even if you solve squat, you haven't solved the actual problem.

As you point out, the vehicle manufacturer knows what his vehicle can handle, and tongue weight is one of the specs that must be honored. The spec usually comes from the component capability of the vehicle's rear suspension - wheel bearings, shocks, wheels, etc. Air bags and helper springs don't change the capability of any of those. But as the name implies, a "weight distributing hitch" distributes some of the hitch weight away from the rear suspension - some of it going forward onto the front axle of the tow vehicle and some going rearward onto the TM axle. Depending on the specific hitch and its adjustment, as much as a couple hundred pounds can be moved. When that happens, the front of the tow vehicle is more heavily loaded, so it sinks a bit on its suspension. And the rear end of the tow vehicle is able to rise a bit because of the reduced load. The effect is to bring the tow vehicle back toward level. AS A SIDE EFFECT, this reduces squat. But the primary effect is to reduce the hitch weight carried by the rear suspension.

Ads for helper springs or air bags promise to reduce squat, and they do that. Don't misinterpret those ads. They don't reduce rear suspension load, which is the real goal. Weight distributing hitches are more expensive than air bags for a reason. They are more complex (though much easier to install) than bags or springs.

You might take a look at the tutorials on the subject in the TM Technical Library at
https://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2616
https://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2922
https://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21037

Or search the internet for articles on "how weight distributing hitches work", rather than "eliminating tow vehicle squat". This article from GoodSam seems good.

https://community.goodsam.com/t5/rv-tips-tricks/weight-distribution-wd-hitch-how-it-works/m-p/2681

As I noted in my first post, some vehicles can't use a WDH, often for reasons related to lack of a real frame. If your vehicle can't use a WDH, that's unfortunate, since there is no other realistic way to reduce the trailer's tongue weight. But that is not the issue that a WDH is intended to address, so please don't mis-state the function of a WDH. You must obey the mfr's specs including the actual tongue weight - even if you use bags to cure squat.

Respectfully submitted

Bill

 

[Dan3023]

I agree with most things you said Bill. I just don't see why the push for a weight distribution hitch when we already know that the vehicle can't use one. Now, the weight is within limits, but it will still squat. The only way a person can get rid of that squat is with helper springs/air bags. And no matter what, you can not exceed the tongue weight limit of the vehicle. A weight distribution hitch does not take any weight from the hitch. It actually adds tongue weight because the hitch itself is heavy. If the OP stays within the total weight and tongue weight, it is totally safe to use air bags to level the vehicle while towing. Remember, a Sorento cannot use a weight distribution hitch. That should have been taken out of consideration long ago.

 

[Bill]

I looked into this a while back.

You highlighted only part of the answer, in red here. The complete answer was

"[highlight]No, a weight distribution hitch does not reduce the tongue weight[/highlight] but it does redistribute it across the towing vehicle and trailer. A weight distribution hitch moves weight from the back of the tow vehicle to the front axle and trailer axles."

This is a problem with AI searches - it isn't sure what you are asking. In this case, it thinks that you were asking about the tongue weight of the trailer as measured if you set the bare tongue on a scale. And it is right - a WDH can't change that. But what you are really asking is whether the entire amount must be carried by the rear of the tow vehicle. And the un-highlighted part of the answer says that a WDH can change that.

Bill

 

[Dan3023]

No, I was actually asking about tongue weight as that is the important factor here. I fully understand the workings of a WDH. They work great for vehicles that can actually use them. They do not reduce tongue weight though, weight on the ball is the same. Plus, that is totally irrelevant to this situation as a Sorento cannot use a WDH. The only real option is air bags here.