converter charger size - Hi-Lo camper travel trailer forum

COLLINGWOOD · 08-04-2016, 10:10 AM

I have two group27 deep cycle batteries hooked up in parallel and wondering what amp size my converter is.We plan to spend a lot of time boomdocking and will need to charge the batteries using my Honda 2000i inverter generator. I was thinking of hooking up a 20amp smart charger to the generator and connect directly to battery bank. I have heard that a smart charger is much better for charging the batteries and will extend the life of the batteries.
I also read that a lot of converters in campers are not smart type converters .
I have a 2009 22'hilo anyone know what type of converter is in it?

JackandJanet · 08-04-2016, 11:00 AM

Hi - Since you have a recent trailer, I'm positive your converter will go to "float" charging once the batteries have reached a state of near fully charged. "Float" does not "boil" the batteries, which DOES damage them.

An alternative, and one that I employ at home, is to use a Battery Minder that, in addition to having the "float" cycle also employs desulfication which is even better for your batteries. This can be plugged into a generator too, so that it will charge the batteries that way. My Battery Minder has three selectable charging rates if the batteries are low: 2A, 4A and 8A. Normally, I just leave it on 2A, because the batteries are generally fully charged, but I could select higher rates if needed. It also has a temperature sensor that controls the charging current according to temperature too. Finally, you can select "Wet Cell", "Low Maint" or "Gell".

Mine is an older product and I have to manually select the features I described above. Here is a link to a newer version that is totally automatic: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...roSxoC9K_w_wcB

As you see, it costs a bit, but I think it's worth it.

- Jack

COLLINGWOOD · 08-04-2016, 06:33 PM

Thanks Jack. wonder though can you use two chargers hooked to the battery at the same time. The converter and the battery minder. I read somewhere that it is not a good idea to use two chargers at the same time. do you leave the battery minder hooked up to the battery all the time, where do you mount it, near the battery

hilltool · 08-04-2016, 08:30 PM

I agree with jack ( as usual)..in that I'm sure your converter has "smart"capacity though not as "smart" as the battery minder. I have a 2001 trailer and I know that converter goes to a float charge. If you bought a new converter you can get them much fancier- including ones that are actually inverters as well-----but they are very pricey. I am no expert here, but I would advise AGAINST using the converter and battery minder simultaneoulsy as I am guessing the "smart" part of either one of them is programmed to be only smart for "itself". Who knows what kind of feedback either one would be getting from the charge coming in from the other unit and how it would respond. I also run with two group 27s in parallel. In the winter- I pull my batteries to keep them from freezing (trailer is stored at a remote location with no power) and hook a battery minder to them in my attached garage. You might want to do the same thing in Saskatchewan as, though we Wisconsinites like to boast of our winter bonafides---- you clearly have us beat up there.

Rick

JackandJanet · 08-04-2016, 11:25 PM

Like Rick said, DON'T use the Battery Minder and the Converter simultaneously. I use one or the other when the trailer is in storage. If I were to charge the batteries with the generator while camping, I'd either plug the trailer's shore power plug into the generator or plug the Battery Minder into the generator, again, not both at once.

I don't "mount" the Battery Minder anywhere, I just sit it on top of the battery compartment when I use it. I suppose though, it would fit inside the shore power cord compartment. The battery charging wire and the power cord to it would come out from under the door, even with the door closed.

And, the Battery Minder comes with a connection that can be screwed onto the battery terminals that has a polarized quick disconnect that connects to the Minder's charging cord, so it's very easy to attach and unattach.

It also comes with an alligator type battery charging connection that I never use.

- Jack

COLLINGWOOD · 08-05-2016, 04:10 AM

Thanks guys I get it . I also remove the batteries in winter and leave them hooked up to trickle charger 2A over winter in the garage. keeps them charged up and ready to go in the spring.
I did note that the batteries were not hooked up properly. they were hooked up in parallel but both the positive and the negative was connected to the first battery, As recommended I changed it to positive connection on the first battery and negative connection to the second battery so they would charge equally. I think I also need to change the connections from the converter wiring positive to positive of first battery and negative to negative of second battery Am I right about that? Not sure yet which wires are from the converter, need to check the outlet on the converter to idenify.

hilltool · 08-05-2016, 10:31 AM

COLLINGWOOD

Per things I have read- I also hook up my batteries so that the negative and positive "active" cables for anything are attached to the different batteries. My understanding is this keeps both charging and discharging rates more equal on both batteries. On my trailer- The converter is tied into the system in such a way that the current is coming through the "main" cables- so, yes, I have the positive on one battery and the negative on another. As I think I mentioned earlier, I also have my batteries configured so the positive post on one battery is towards the "front" and the negative of the other battery is towards the front. That way, it is easier for me to access the posts or cables by just lifting the trailer enough to get the first hinged "door" on the battery box open enough to get a jumper cable connected or take readings.

Rick

JackandJanet · 08-05-2016, 11:02 AM

Placing the charging cables and "draw" wiring on different batteries when the two are wired in parallel DOES make a slight difference when either charging or discharging due to the internal resistance of the wires, but if the wires are sized properly, I doubt there is a significant effect. And, as soon as the batteries go into a resting state, they equalize quickly. Still, I wire my two batteries this way too - so we're all on the same page.

Rick, that's a good idea to reverse orient the batteries to make it easier to attach jumper cables. Mine are not placed that way because I wanted to use shorter jumper cables to tie the batteries together and I've found (through experience) that it's not hard to manually raise the top far enough to get to the battery terminals.

- Jack

COLLINGWOOD · 08-05-2016, 11:12 AM

Great idea on battery order for easy access,when trailer is down. does anyone know how many amps the converter is on a 2009 22' hilo. My reading seems to suggest it may be small amp and I might want to replace it with a bigger amp converter charger since I changed the two group 24 batteries to group 27 batteries giving me more aH total. I will check the manual when I get a chance see what it says.

JackandJanet · 08-05-2016, 01:05 PM

I don't have any idea what the charging current is, but you don't really want it to be super high. That is not good for the batteries, because it overheats them. As I recall, and my rapidly fading brain cells may be not telling me the truth, the converter is a 45 Amp device. That's the input to it, but you connect to a 30 Amp max supply at a campground.

I'm guessing, and this is only a guess, if the 45 Amp figure is right, it's to handle a momentary surge that would occur if everything electrical was ON and the air conditioner started up.

It's also possible I'm mistaken and the converter is 30 Amps.

I think if you supply 8-10 Amps into the batteries, that should be a sufficient charging rate if they are low. The charging wires from the converter are not particularly heavy - 10 gauge, so they can't handle much more current than that.

- Jack

hilltool · 08-05-2016, 01:52 PM

"Rick, that's a good idea to reverse orient the batteries to make it easier to attach jumper cables. Mine are not placed that way because I wanted to use shorter jumper cables to tie the batteries together and I've found (through experience) that it's not hard to manually raise the top far enough to get to the battery terminals."

Actually, and this may be a function of the larger/longer battery, I cannot get to the posts closest to the trailer body without removing screws on the back of the battery box cover. So- even if I just want to take a multi meter reading- or attach the clips on my water transfer pump, I can do so easily by just opening the first "flap". I dont know- they may have made later boxes more accessible. The "non-parallel orientation" tends to leave everything that I need more handy.

I think the info in my manual said my converter was thirty amp- but i will have to check to affirm that.

Rick

JackandJanet · 08-05-2016, 03:21 PM

Rick, I'd thought 30 Amp too, for a long time. But I'm fairly sure I saw 45 Amps recently (somewhere). I dunno though, I've been wrong lots of times.

Your reasoning for orienting the batteries the way you do makes perfect sense to me!

- Jack

RichR · 08-05-2016, 04:27 PM

"I think" all later year models had 45 amp convertors. I always thought the 45 amp(DC) was the maximum output rating which would only be needed for raising the top, and times when all the lights, furnace, and 12 volt mode fridge would be turned on plus charging the battery. 45 amp(AC) input would be a mighty hefty power level.

hilltool · 08-05-2016, 05:34 PM

ok. mine is 32, 2001 model. Jack's is newer and I think I remember,also, seeing that newer ones had 45 amp. battery photo is just showing my arrangement-

Rick

sam · 08-05-2016, 08:45 PM

DH installed a new converter earlier this year. I probably did a post on this. The old one was 30amps and the new one was 45amps. We just called Best converter in CA and told the tech what we had and he told us which one to get. Just about all the folks that own Airstream trailers get their converters at Best converters. The new ones are a nice upgrade from the old ones.

COLLINGWOOD · 08-06-2016, 06:14 PM

next question is are they smart chargers or simple charging continuously. I have heard two different stories. one that they are simple but go into a float setting. another that they do not go into a float stage when charged. I will be checking mine and if it is not a 3-4 stage charger I will be replacing it with a more efficient smart converter charger that will hopefully fit where the current one is. I'll let you know when I confirm what mine is and if I find a replacement that will easily fit into current location.

COLLINGWOOD · 08-06-2016, 06:17 PM

I also read the your converter charger should be C10 which is 10percent of your total bank Ah. I have two group 27 deep cycle which are rated at 105Ah each totalling 210Ah so I would think the max charger should be 20amp. Yet everone is talking 30-45 amp chargers?

hilltool · 08-06-2016, 06:23 PM

Collingwood- Get the info (model #) off your converter and then google the mfg and get the specs there. Mine goes into a float stage but I am not sure how many actual stages the chrarger is. I'm not sure about the other reference you are making to C10 but it is not something I have run across in all my readings and I think you will find that with a decent multi stage charger/controller the more amps you throw at it the faster you can get your battery bank up to 100%, which is what you are after. The controller will make sure you are not over charging the battery.

Rick