Demolition Begins

[robobd]

for your styrofoam to fiberglass glue j & r uses a 2 part glue that is time sensitive to application.. it also must be clamped together when bonding. also if you are testing glues for your ceiling and walls , don't forget heat and cool cycles, as some glues will freeze and loose their adhesion,then when heated,it will expand

 

[sam-HILO]

Glues for repair

If you were going to send the trailer into JR repair I believe after talking to them this what they would do. Disconnect the top and bottom half. Then a crane would be used to lift the top half off. Everything would be totally striped off to the skin. The skin would be treated on the inside with maybe bondo or something similar to seal any pinholes and guarantee no leaks. Every inch of metal studs would be sprayed with primer and rust oleum paint. Then the walls would be put back together with a laminating machine. Two part glue would be used. In my opinion the material you use to put the walls back together just have to be acliminated a day before install. We were very successful in using Heavy Duty liquid nails and a floor roller to put in the underlay and styrofoam and paneling. It would have been a nightmare to use time sensitive glue two part. In other words we aren,t comparing apples to oranges. Home repair vs JR repair. I can only share with you what we did and what worked for us. I may well have the sequence wrong what JR does. Who wouldn,t love to have the trailer factory repaired. Isn,t worth the $ vs value on our 1990 HiLo.

 

[sam-HILO]

Demolition

Gary, Had DH read your post. All your plans are good. Love your choice of ceiling panels and wall paneling. Is the wall paneling vinyl coated? We found in our BR that the walls had two layers of paneling,stryrofoam and underlay. Still didn,t keep them from getting water dammaged. Had a discussion with DH about the Bondo we used on the walls. We got this two part epoxy at an auto/body speciaty shop. They sell to all the local body shops. He thinks this is different from what you can buy at walmart. In other words not the same product. Trust me on this one. Better to seal your walls with this premium bondo and lexell caulk than to do a half job and have leaks. Whennall is said and done you will have a sweet trailer that you can use for many years to come. It will be worth far more than you paid for it!!!! Take your do it once and do it right. So excited for you.

 

[garyk52]

Sam, I believe my walls are different from yours. Yours looks like it is corregated while mine is smooth, no ridges or valleys. I don't see any light looking from inside out like pinholes or anything when turning lights on inside and looking outside to inside when it's dark out. And yes, the paneling is vinyl coated.

Cheers
GaryK

 

[garyk52]

Vdubn,

I'm going to use a combination of Liquid Nails and Henry 663 (doesn't dissolve foam) indoor outdoor carpet adhesive. Should be good for all temps. I redid my test using a 3 lb weight instead of the 5 lb. It's been hanging in my basement since 12/10/2011 (3 lb weight hanging from 3x6 inch piece of paneling.) Ceiling will be a combination of Liquid nails, Henry 663 and trusty 1/4 crown staples and the wall will be mostly Henry 663 with a small amount of Liquid Nails and possibly some Gorilla glue. I'm also going to cut 2 inch slots 1/2 inch deep in the styrofoam around the perimeter with my table saw and glue in plywood strips.

Cheers
GaryK

 

[sam-HILO]

Demolition

DH read your posts.I realize you walls are different from ours. Please strongly consider using Bondo on your walls. You could possibly havecracks or sm. holes you can't see. They even do this with wall rebuilding at JR in Ohio. I know they make liquid nails in a gallon size. It might be more cost effective,also more messy to apply to the wall paneling. Sounds like a good plan to cut strips for reinforcing in the walls. DH suggested that you might cut into the styrofoam easier with a Multi function tool. If you don't own you could pick up a cheap one from harbour freight. That is where we got ours. At any rate you will fabricate as you go along. We are going to visit our HiLo tomorrow and put in the two new LED bulbs. I,ll see if it passes cleaning inspection. DH did this while I was in the Hosp. I'm pretty sure you will want to use liquid nails only to install your wall paneling as per manufacture instructions. Be sure to aclimate your material to the HiLo before cutting/fitting.DH left the paneling in the trailer a day before cutting. Forgot to mention that we did a rebuild on our door a few years ago. so we were sure it didn't have to be removed for repaneling.

 

[garyk52]

Sam,

I bought a Harbor Freight multi-function tool before I started tearing the camper apart. Best $20 I ever spent on a tool. I'm going to try and make a foam cutting wire and use my weller soldering iron to heat the wire in places where I can't use the table saw or router. I used to fly RC planes and cut foam wings using a homemade foam cutting bow using a 8 amp battery charger. So I will see what I can come up with. Didn't the heavy duty liquid nails eat into the styrofoam or did you use foamboard which is a little different from the styrofoam which is in the camper.

Cheers
GaryK

 

[sam-HILO]

Demolition

We used 1" foam insulation. We might have been able to use different glues but we had to run the furnice. The HD liquid nails was the only glue that would grip and hold. Once we put the glue on and placed the insulation,underlay or paneling we never pulled it off. DH sealed the deal with pressure from his floor roller. We just came from Home Depot. We were looking at ADA toilets. The one we wanted Kohler no longer caries in biscuit. ANyway we are in no hury. I cruised by the carpet glue to see if I could read the henry can and see if it was recommended for paneling. They now carry some other brand. I,m thinking you had this left over from some other project and just want to use it up. Can,t say as I blame you. Materials are so expensive. If you arer doing some of your project in blazing hot weather you may be able to use a lesser liquid nails. When we tried contact cement it just soaked into the foam insulation and had no glue factor left. The foam liquid nails just didn't stick at all. Can't remember if their was a price difference between regular liquid nails in the tube or HD liquid nails.I,m sure you will have the time of your life with this project. The multi tool is inexpensive the blades cost as much as the tool.

 

[vdubn]

Vdubn,

I'm going to use a combination of Liquid Nails and Henry 663 (doesn't dissolve foam) indoor outdoor carpet adhesive. Should be good for all temps.

I spoke with J&R about using Liquid Nails, and they were pretty adamant about not using it, since it dries hard. They said that you need an adhesive that dries flexible, as our trailers flex a ton. I also stopped by my local trailer store to ask what they use in their trailers, and they showed me their gallon sized can of standard Contact Cement, which dries soft and adheres to foam, etc.

My father-in-law used to lay carpet, and said that Contact Cement should work excellent, so that was my plan. I'm not familiar with Henry 663, but will look into it.

I know that they make tons of different types of Liquid Nails, so maybe you found one that dries soft and will work well.

I'm also going to cut 2 inch slots 1/2 inch deep in the styrofoam around the perimeter with my table saw and glue in plywood strips.

Cheers
GaryK

I am also going to do this, as I have channels already cut in my foam, where there was like 1/4 or 5/16 plywood already, that was the anchor for the cabinets (it was totally rotted in mine, hence the reason my cabinet was falling from the roof). I was thinking of using OSB instead of plywood, as I thought it might be resistant to water more than plywood... any thoughts?

 

[sam-HILO]

Discussion on what glue to use for repairs

Vdubn, could you start at the beginning of your story. Do you have a classic or a towlite.? It is it just one cupboard that you have to remount? Look under 90 Classic restoration to my description and pictures of each step of our restoration. We did our restoration this past fall 2011 and early 2012. We had to run our furnice to be able to have a consistent temp and for the bondo and heavy duty liquid nails to dry properly. We tried contact cement and it just soaked in and wouldn;t hold anything. I have just about a gallon of contact cement left that cost me $42.00 plus tax. No projects in mind to use this on. The point I want to make is that JR has the equipment to laminate 1" styrofoam insulation,1/4 underlay and 1/4 paneling to the walls. In a DIY situation our directions on the paneling called for liquid nails. We also used 1" paneling nails along the seams and stapled trim at the ceiling. Our paneling was left in the RV to aclimate prior toinstalation. I sure am not going to pull it off to see if the liquid nails dried out. We only use the Rv about one month a year. Dh has a large garden and plenty of lawn mowing weed wacking to do in the summer ect. I,m curious as to what JR would recommend to glue the lays together for repair. We tried contact cement.ragular liquid nails,liquid nails for foam board and none of this worked. My gut feeling is if it had been blazing hot then the contact cement might have worked. I,l let everyone know how the repairs hold up.

 

[robobd]

sam, i mean no disrespect when i quoted what j & r uses or used to assemble my wall when they rebuilt my 88 22L, I was just trying to help a fellow hi-lo guy,and i wish that i had the help and knoledge to do an extensive rebuild like yours. I admire your extensive work, and the ability to try other application methods,i especially like how garyk52 tested and reported his findings to try to duplicate or better the "j&r way" this not only lets us know it can be done but also saves us a bunch of money, which we could all use for the raising gas prices. by the way, your work on your hi-lo which i have been following daily, is fantastic, it looks better than new!

 

[robobd]

contact cement

when i apply contact cement to raw or bare wood, i always apply a heavy coat on the bare wood,let it soak in and dry for at least an hour, then reapply the contact cement to both application sides, let it tack up to being almost dry, then apply. I would test it first like you did with the weights

 

[garyk52]

I spoke with J&R about using Liquid Nails, and they were pretty adamant about not using it, since it dries hard. They said that you need an adhesive that dries flexible, as our trailers flex a ton. I also stopped by my local trailer store to ask what they use in their trailers, and they showed me their gallon sized can of standard Contact Cement, which dries soft and adheres to foam, etc.

My father-in-law used to lay carpet, and said that Contact Cement should work excellent, so that was my plan. I'm not familiar with Henry 663, but will look into it.

I know that they make tons of different types of Liquid Nails, so maybe you found one that dries soft and will work well.



I am also going to do this, as I have channels already cut in my foam, where there was like 1/4 or 5/16 plywood already, that was the anchor for the cabinets (it was totally rotted in mine, hence the reason my cabinet was falling from the roof). I was thinking of using OSB instead of plywood, as I thought it might be resistant to water more than plywood... any thoughts?

There's a reason OSB is less than half the cost of plywood. OSB won't hold screws as good as plywood. OSB doesn't like moisture. I don't like using OSB

Cheers
Garyk

Will LIQUID NAILS Adhesive products become rock hard after they dry?

No. LIQUID NAILS construction adhesive and caulk products remain flexible to allow for expansion and contraction of the substrates.

LIQUID NAILS Adhesive FAQs

 

[vdubn]

There's a reason OSB is less than half the cost of plywood. OSB won't hold screws as good as plywood. OSB doesn't like moisture. I don't like using OSB

Cheers
Garyk

Will LIQUID NAILS Adhesive products become rock hard after they dry?

No. LIQUID NAILS construction adhesive and caulk products remain flexible to allow for expansion and contraction of the substrates.

LIQUID NAILS Adhesive FAQs

Good to know... I wonder why J&R were so against the use of liquid nails? Thanks for the info, I will be using plywood for my walls as well.

 

[sam-HILO]

Discussion on glues.

Robod, no offense taken. I never thought to go on the site for liquid nails. I thought maybe we had goofed. Our directions from georgia pacific said to use liquid nails. If we didn,t we would have voided the warranty on the paneling. Our HiLo dealer also told us to use liquid nails. Our dealer hates wall rebuilding with a passion as it is very time consuming. Shure who wouldn,t love to have a factory rebuild(laminated process). Spent some time reviewing Mark Polk and his 69 Yellowstone and was horrified to see he only used a combo stainpoly on one side of his wall rebuild. He had to do tons of frame rebuilding and left all the wood bare. He used no glue whatsoever. Everything else he did on the trailer was aplus,very talented. Very scary to just reapply the old skin and depend on the caulk to prevent water intrusion. The old trailer did have a metal roof and he did replace it with a rubber roof. Thanks for the compliments on our restoration job. I was expecting it to turn out reasonably well as DH is a sheet metal fabricator with lots of additional course work and life experiences. Thanks for the explination on using contact cement. I do have a structure under our celler stairs that hubby painted redwood before I knew him. I hate redwood and we will be refacing. Probably could use the contact cement. I will try to do this in the summer when it is blazing hot. Wouldn;t know what to do withmy self if I didn;t have some kind of project going!!.

 

[vdubn]

Gary, what are you using for replacement paneling in side of your trailer? I have been looking at the 1/8" bathroom paneling that is fiber-backed, at Home Depot, and it looks like it should work well. I will have to scuff it though, as its really smooth, then primer it, and paint it.

I was told by the fellows at J&R, that I could also primer my original vinyl covered paneling, with Kilz or BINZ, then I could paint it as well, that way the whole wall can match.

Just curious what your plans were.

 

[garyk52]

vdubn,

if you go back to message 20 on this thread, you can see the paneling my wife and I picked out. I need 10 sheets at around $30.00 a sheet. That will do the whole top except for the ends which I'm not doing. I'm using plywood paneling with a vinyl covering. I looked at the paneling at HD and Lowes and most of theirs is hardboard or mdf and not plywood.

Cheers
Gary

 

[vdubn]

Good Call.... I guess you are replacing all of your paneling at the same time. I may look at a local wood store to see if they have plywood backed paneling as well, but I need to paint all of mine anyway since I am not replacing everything.

Thanks for the help.

 

[sam-HILO]

What paneling?

Just a thought if you could find some hardwood paneling you could use stain/poly to seal both sides. Our underlay had a very pretty grain to it.I stained both sides of five sheets. It was too pretty to cover up. My only thought with paint is how is it going to look if you get a bang in the paint. I wish I could have bought the matching wallpaper to be able to do the remaining wall and inside end caps.

 

[garyk52]

Vdubn,

Look and see if you can find 1/8 inch lauan and compare it to paneling before you buy. It looks just like plywood with no lines and it looks to be very paintable. I paid $12.71 a sheet including tax. If I was going to paint, that is what I would be putting on the walls and ceiling.

Cheers
Gary