water tank fill up

[DennisB-HILO]

Hi all, I have a 2008 1508t Hi Lo. It has a pretty small fresh water tank.
When I am camping without hookups for more than 2 days, I have to refill my water tank. For this I use a 12 volt powered pump and jerry cans full of new water-this part works well. The problem I have is everytime I add water to the tank I have to open a valve which is under the left side dinette seat-
depending on the circumstances, this can be a hassle. If I leave the valve open all the time then the water pump runs constantly.

So in order to refill , I have to move whatever is on the dinette seat(usually something is stored there during the day) open seat/door that covers the compartment, open the valve, fill the tanks and then go back inside the trailer,
turn the valve off, replace the seat/door, replace cushions and whatever was on top of them when I started.

This is not a huge problem but it is an annoyance-it would be much better if I did not have to access the valve everytime I refilled.

Any suggestions on how to make this an easier process?

Any help/ideas would be appreciated!

thanks,
Dennis

 

[JackandJanet]

Hi Dennis - I have no thoughts on this. My 1707T does not have the "valve" you speak of. I just open the fill door on the front of the trailer, stick the hose from the pump in, and the tank fills. I have no idea why your trailer needs the extra valve. What happens if you try filling the tank without opening the valve?

The only valves I have in the vicinity of the pump are the ones for winterizing that bypass the hot water tank. There are two drain valves downstream from the pump that empty the supply lines to the faucets and toilet too.

- Jack

 

[RichR]

I've been around a lot of Hi-Lo trailers and have never seen that type of hookup. All late models normally have the fresh water fill, like Jack mentioned. ???

 

[retiredcamper47]

My 2001 had a valve where I could fill the freshwater tank thru the city water fill. It was easier to fill this way rather than using the gravity fill port. I would turn the valve open to fill and then close the valve to use the pump, otherwise the pump could not pressurize the system.

Bob

 

[JackandJanet]

Great post, Bob! This sounds like what Dennis is describing. I don't have anything like that in my trailer.

Dennis, where are you putting the water in? Do you possibly have another input point, usually behind a door with a lock on it, in the vicinity of the fresh water tank? On my trailer, the City Water Inlet is on the front street side of the lower half. The "Gravity Fill", that Bob is talking about is on the front lower half of the trailer near the street side. It is behind a door, and has a screw-on cap over the inlet.

- Jack

 

[DennisB-HILO]

Water tank fill up

thanks for the replies.


there is no way I can see to put water into the tank other than the city hookup that is near the water tank left hand curb side.
The valve I am speaking of controls the flow of water from the city hook up to the tank. If I leave the valve open, the water pump runs constantly(I think someone said that is the system trying to pressurize)

I suppose I could leave the valve open and then only turn on the water pump when using the sink or toilet but I am not sure that will be any less annoying.

I have attached photos of the valve and the exterior of the trailer in case I am missing something-

I have had two other small trailers and they both had fillups that were just gravity fed-this seems pretty weird-

any ideas or input would be appreciated-

thanks again,
Dennis

 

[JackandJanet]

Well, I think you're right, Dennis. I see no gravity feed inlet for your freshwater tank in the photos you posted, and I don't think it would be located anywhere else. I would certainly advise AGAINST attempting to add such a fill - it would involve surgery to the tank and possibly cause damage that you could not fix.

So, I'm at a loss. Maybe someone else will have a brilliant idea. I agree, it would be a total pain to have to access that valve each time you need to fill the tank, and I don't see an easy way to reposition that valve either..

- Jack

 

[retiredcamper47]

Dennis, Is it possible you could install a small compartment door outside near the water fill? That way you could access that valve from the outside and without doing any plumbing reconfiguration. All items could remain on the inside bench untouched. You would have to be careful with choosing the proper door so that it cleared when raising and lowering the top. Perhaps a gravity fill door unit with the “insides” cut out. You would only be using the door and frame. Hope this helps.


Bob

 

[JackandJanet]

I knew someone else would have a brilliant thought (unlike me). Great idea, Bob.

In studying the two pictures on my bigger desktop screen, though, is it possible you could reach the valve using the hot water tank access door?

- Jack

 

[marininn]

You possibly tap into the pipes near the tank, the same pipe that the pump pulls through. Put a T inline and send the new pipe to the outer wall, I guess next to the current city hook up. Use the same kind of fitting on the outside wall, but not one with a one-way valve. The valve could slow things down. Instead, just use a cap to seal it off when done. OR if you can adapt a gravity fill thing to it then better yet.
You use a male hose end to screw to the fitting and adapt some kind of funnel if not.

Or you could use the drain underneath to fill. Rig up connectors so it is easy to pour water in or connect to whatever you will use as a funnel. As long as the funnel is over the surface of the water then water will flow into the tank from underneath.
The drain is seldom used, if ever, during the camping season (just for winterizing), so you can keep your connectors set up for rapid filling all the time.

Just a few ideas…

 

[goodoleboy]

I'm no expert but it sounds like the water tank is pressurized by the pump and the valve you are opening is the bleed valve for draining the tank. Try turning off the pump and opening the faucet when filling. Then try filling the tank. The air that is in the tank needs to go somewhere. On my 27T there is an outside valve that you open to allow the air to bleed off when filling.

 

[marininn]

Did u fix this?
Yes, you have a valve to fill the tank from city water pressure and then turn valve to let pump pressurize the system when not hooked up. Running the pump with valve open (to fill tank) will just circulate water from tank through pipes and then back to tank - you may get a little dribble at the faucet from all this water moving, but not enough.

You can add a second city water connection on the outside of camper, this is way less obtrusive than adding a gravity fill as it only requires a small hole about an inch. Run this second one straight to the tank, remove the valve's connection to the water tank and let that pressurize the pipes/faucet/shower. You will have to make sure the connection to city (for faucets) is after the water pump obviously. The connection to the water tank (to fill) will be before the water pump.

Next option is to re-route your pipes, moving the valve to somewhere more easy to get to. Use a PEX brass 1.4 turn lever instead of that cheapo plastic valve. Fits the ½ inch pipe just the same. You can make the lever poke out a hole and keep the valve behind a wall, so only the lever pokes out and you never have to open the compartment.

There is no easier fix than these.


I made the mode you have on purpose…
mine:



The foam is top of tank.
Big pipe is gravity fill, you do not have this.
Clear tube is the vent, you do have this.
Red pipe on right is new line part of the bypass.
Valve lets water from city flow into the tank or blocks it from flowing into tank. When open water flows into the tank, when closed no water flows through the red pipe on the right.
Pump will try to pressurize the system no matter the valve selection.
The pump has a check-valve so water will not run backwards through it.

 

[Tomsher]

The 15T does not have a gravity fill. The water tank is mounted on the floor in the dinette
seat. There would be no way to run the large fill tubing without it being above the seat to get proper flow.
There is no small tubing vent as mentioned in the previous post. Instead the large tubing is used as the vent. it comes out of the side of the tank near the top and is routed directly to a hole in the floor. a big problem is that while traveling a large amount of water splashes out of the tank through the vent. My previous post on this has a photo of the tank. http://www.hilotrailerforum.com/f27/fresh-water-tank-vent-2319/

 

[marininn]

tomsher, this is crazyness!

The pic in your link shows little. Where exactly does the big "vent" tube go?

I can see the hot water heater is beside it, so I assume the tube is above the floor.

My trailer is an 2009 15t.The HI/LO folks decided to use the 1&1/4" fill connection as the vent. The problem is the vent is to big and below the top of the tank.When traveling about half the water in the tank splashes out of the vent. Has anyone else encountered this problem?

You say the tube is on the side, so your photo is looking down from above?
The wall to the right in photo is the side of the dinette seat?
If so, then that tube goes out of the tank and then down?

You need to fix this!!!

Ideally you make that tube go higher and put in an outside gravity fill, but you say it cant be done.
You will need to spend some time at a hardware store finding parts, but make a step-down so big tube goes to little vinyl tube (air vent), and then route little vent tube at least a foot higher and to the outside world.
…or you can route vent tube a foot up, then route it down and exit out the floor. (this might siphon a few drops extra out when it sloshes, but should not be an issue)

One odd option is to route the vent tube so it spills into either the sink or the shower. Doing this will not be the most pretty though as you are adding an additional appliance to the sink. Disguise it as a soap dispenser. I had a class-c camper I built where the vent tube (tank below floor) spilled out just below the shower faucet onto the shower floor. Worked perfect. Keeping the vent tube outlet inside is a lot more hygienic.

There is ½ inch pipe going into the top of tank. This is the fill? What is that valve, is it an on/off valve or is it a T and another pipe comes in from below where the valve is an A-B selector switch?

another solution, more complicated. Cap off the big tube opening completely shut and air tight.
Re-route the fill from city water to Tee into the bottom ½ fitting where the water pump pulls water out. (so, you fill water at the same outlet as the water drains out.) You will add valves, see my photo above post for routing.
Then this leaves the top fitting to be an air vent only.
Only do this is you cannot step down the big tube to a small air vent tube.

 

[Tomsher]

The picture is looking down from the top. the vent tube comes from the tank and goes down to a hole in the floor. The vent is the large corrugated tube. the picture is from before I installed smaller fittings and tubing. We don't dry camp so loosing water while traveling is the only problem which I have largely corrected.
This tube also acts as the overflow when using the city water connection to fill the tank so it can't be blocked off.

 

[jon121587]

Where is the drain valve shutoff on your 1707T? When I fill my tank water pours out of the bottom drain.

QUOTE=JackandJanet;42300]Hi Dennis - I have no thoughts on this. My 1707T does not have the "valve" you speak of. I just open the fill door on the front of the trailer, stick the hose from the pump in, and the tank fills. I have no idea why your trailer needs the extra valve. What happens if you try filling the tank without opening the valve?

The only valves I have in the vicinity of the pump are the ones for winterizing that bypass the hot water tank. There are two drain valves downstream from the pump that empty the supply lines to the faucets and toilet too.

- Jack[/QUOTE]

 

[JackandJanet]

jon - welcome to the forum. It's not clear to me what you mean by the "bottom drain". Are you talking about water coming out of a drain underneath the body of the trailer? If so, the shutoff is just above that location, in one of the lines leading to the kitchen/bathroom. I can get to mine by opening the outside side door in the bottom half of my trailer.

The only other drain is for the fresh water tank, located on the curb side and it is on the outside corner.

- Jack

 

[hilltool]

My gravity fill is around the corner on the front. This doesn’t sound like the issue, though. I’d call Jane r and ask them got insight.

 

[marininn]

The system drain valves should be directly above where the water pipe spills out through the floor, or just within inches. The valve usually located at the lowest point, so there will not be a pipe run after the valve, it will exit in the shortest distance possible. The lowest poit of course is the floor, but it will also be between things that need to be drained, like two faucets (kitchen one and the bathroom one). The water heater can drain itself as can the water tank, so do not look for the pipe drain at those.

All are different, but mine was located under the oven and hard to reach through a little compartment door, but was accessible.

Your OP is not talking about a drain valve.

Your setup might be something that was customized by a previous owner. I have never heard of a manufacturer having the valve you describe, but by no means does this mean they do not.

I custom added such a valve to two of my rigs. One did not have the gravity fill port. The valve does allow you to fill the water tank through the city inlet. This is a little cleaner as there is no open fill spout to let stuff in. There is a one-way valve in the water pump, but might also be one after the pump in the pipes and lets city water come in to pressurize the pipes and not put back-pressure on the water pump.
A "fill valve" would let that pressurized city water go into the water tank through an additional pipe routed from the pressurized pipe back to the water pump. Excess water escapes out the air vent or out the gravity fill spout (if equipped).

A solution is to add a new "city connection" on the outside of the camper that connects to pipes that go directly into the water tank. This could be the pipe that feeds the water pump from the water tank; just "T" into it and water will flow into the tank (the water pump will not let it pass unless the motor is running). This would only fill the tank, not provide water pressure to the plumbing system. This will be a little easier than moving pillows.
Might be easier to just move your existing valve to somewhere easier than plumb in all this new stuff mentioned above.

You either have 1/2 plastic pvc pipe or you have PEX pipe. PEX is easier to work with, but either pipe can be pieced together with Shark Bite fittings, and you can buy a pipe cutter for plastic fairly cheap. Watch an instructional video and then go for it. I prefer to crimp my fittings and use brass, but I have done a lot of pipes and the crimper is more costly, yet the brass fittings are cheaper than the shark bite ones so crimping was cheaper for me given I did so many fittings.

 

[jon121587]

So I don't have a shut off at all. Nothing near the fill area or where the drain is or above it. I may have to add a shut off where the bottom drain is. Here is the picture if the drain.